Clara Matonhodze:
Hello, everyone, and welcome to Roots, Routes & Voices That Shape America. I’m your host, Clara Matonhodze, founder of the MCS Agency and a passionate storyteller of immigrant journeys and community connections.
Bryan Wright:
And I’m Bryan Wright, executive director of Cincinnati Compass and your cohost. Here, we dive into compelling immigrant stories that offer insight into what it truly takes to become American.
Clara Matonhodze:
And today, we are really thrilled to have Nazly Mamedova with us, an acclaimed immigration attorney whose journey began in a country that no longer exists, if you can believe that. Nazly’s story is a powerful testament to the resilience and determination required to build a new life in America.
Bryan Wright:
Thanks for joining us, Nazly.
Nazly Mamedova:
Thank you for having me. I am happy to be here and to talk to you about this
Clara Matonhodze:
That’s awesome. Welcome, Nazly. Thanks so much for joining us. Now, Nazly, we’re gonna get right into it. Can you tell us about your early experiences growing up? How did those early years shape your understanding of home and belonging?
Nazly Mamedova:
Yes. Absolutely. And my whole story of, like, childhood and growing up is so convoluted. I was born in the Soviet Union. Like Claire said, the countries that don’t exist anymore. And I was born in Uzbekistan, and my dad’s family is from Azerbaijan. My mom’s family is half Crimean, half Turkish. But the reason I was born there is because my family has experienced deportations under Stalin’s rule.
Nazly Mamedova:
So my grandparents from my mom’s side have been deported from Georgia and Crimea, and then, my dad ended up being in Uzbekistan because his sister moved there to study, but I was born there. And, you know, because of all this mix, I end up learning several languages. Actually, we spoke four at home and then picked up more and more. And now I’m affluent at seven. So, a couple more need to learn, but that’s, like, my retirement project.
Clara Matonhodze:
That’s seven more than a lot of us know how to speak that way. But can you give us a little geographic journey just to understand between Uzbekistan and the deportations that were happening in Crimea? Like, I’m trying to figure out where they were being deported from and to where. Can you give us a little geographic lesson around that area of the world?
Nazly Mamedova:
So, during the Soviet Union, under Stalin’s rule, a lot of people, including Stalin, ruled.
Clara Matonhodze:
Which period are we? This is like in the
Nazly Mamedova:
We are talking about our forties. Forties. Okay. Like, before and during World War two. Okay. And, someone was very paranoid. So he looked at those minorities, minority groups. Right.
Nazly Mamedova:
And he was like, I’m going to deport them all and, like, resettle them in different places so they don’t present a danger anymore. And it was very much of an ethnic cleansing and genocide that was actually created. But they took, for example, with Crimean Tatars, they took over 600,000 people, like, and put them in the wagons overnight in the trains and deported them out. A lot of people died during that time, and they sent them out to, like, Central Asia and resettled them there. A similar thing happened with Miss Haiti Turks who were Turks and Muslims, but they were living on the territory of nowadays Georgia.
Clara Matonhodze:
Okay.
Nazly Mamedova:
And this one was even more terrible in terms of when this happened. This happened during winter in November. So a lot of people stayed overnight again in the train because this was like the schemes that they did. Right? So in the trains deported also resettled in Central Asia, and so many died because they simply froze to death. So, really horrific ways of how my family members ended up in Uzbekistan. But both grandparents became doctors, and, mom was born in Uzbekistan, and then my mom met my dad. And
Clara Matonhodze:
Uh-huh. Yeah. I was born. So these were ethnicities that Stalin decided, but they were otherwise Russian, but maybe a smaller ethnic minority. And, like, I’m trying to understand, and I’m sure most people who I do understand. These people who had come from somewhere to settle in Russia? Now we are deporting them back, or these are people that were Russians, but maybe they just didn’t come from the dominant Russian culture.
Nazly Mamedova:
So it wasn’t really like that. It was a little bit different because at that time, it wasn’t like Russia, Ukraine, Uzbekistan, separate countries, really. It was all of the Soviet Union, right, with 15 states in it. Mhmm. And the ethnic groups that were deported weren’t necessarily Russian. It was so there’s a difference when you look at the post Soviet Union. There’s nationality. Your nationality and your citizenship are very different things.
Nazly Mamedova:
We’re here a lot of times now as an immigration attorney, we fill out immigration paperwork and say your nationality. Right?
Clara Matonhodze:
Uh-huh.
Nazly Mamedova:
And in The United States, we mean your citizenship.
Clara Matonhodze:
Uh-huh. Right.
Nazly Mamedova:
But not your ethnic group. Okay. And there, every country had several ethnicities, right, or several people from different ethnicities. And, it was very different in terms of terminology of what it meant
Clara Matonhodze:
Mhmm. Okay.
Nazly Mamedova:
To be a national or a citizen of a certain country. Wow.
Bryan Wright:
So you had mentioned that your parents studied to become doctors in Uzbekistan. Grandparents. Grandparents. Grandparents. And then you mentioned in your household that you spoke four languages.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah.
Bryan Wright:
Right? And now speak seven. So I have two questions. One, I’m curious about what those languages are. And how was that you know, often in multilingual homes, there’s negotiation between two languages. So when you multiply that to four languages, how did that negotiation happen and just easily flow between the four and what yeah. So just curious about yeah. The number of languages and which ones and and, how did you navigate that in the household?
Nazly Mamedova:
Absolutely. So I guess it helped that some of those languages were from the same language groups. Right? So, we spoke Crimean Tatar. We spoke Azerbaijani. We spoke Uzbek and Russian. Uzbek, Crimean Tatar, and Azerbaijani are the same from the same Turkic language group. So that’s made it easier. And then once, you were in the post Soviet Union, right, wherever, in whatever country you were, in whatever state you were, they would have their own language.
Nazly Mamedova:
Right. And Uzbekistan was Uzbek. And then everyone had to learn Russian in schools because that was like a major language. Right? Soviet Union. And then you had your own languages that you spoke at home, and that’s how I ended up growing up with four.
Bryan Wright:
And then what were the other three that you’ve added since?
Nazly Mamedova:
Turkish, which is very similar to Azerbaijani and Crimean Tatar. And then, I speak Spanish and then English.
Clara Matonhodze:
Do you ever mix the languages up? I know me being bilingual, there are a lot of times that I kind of mix the languages. Bryna probably did it with you, but you’ve never noticed because it’s very, you know, it’s very it’s usually like with the connecting words between sentences that I notice I sometimes revert back to the connecting words of, Shona, which is the other language that I speak. Does that ever happen to you?
Nazly Mamedova:
Yes. But what I’ve noticed happens more to me is that now I use the words that are simpler. So if something is easier to say in Spanish, Uh-huh. I sometimes would basically swap the word for another, like, out of the other language. And sometimes I don’t make sense to people. But I’ll be like, you know, saying that that that that. Yes. Yes.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yes. Yes. Yes. Because that is shorter and easier, You know? And agua is easier and shorter to say instead of word water. So, like, depending who I talk to, I might, like, use
Clara Matonhodze:
The symbol.
Nazly Mamedova:
And use the simpler words out of other languages.
Clara Matonhodze:
That happens to me too.
Nazly Mamedova:
And it’s kinda actually, like, great because, like, helps with communication and flow, but it also can be very confusing.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yes. So to whoever is listening is like, what did you say? I’m like, oh.
Bryan Wright:
But I see it can be very and we’ll get into this, you know, later on, but it just seems like in in building trusting relationships with your clients and the community members you work with, being able to speak multiple languages helps you with that outreach to multiple communities and thinking, you know, obviously, there’s a large Spanish speaking community here, a large, community, from Uzbekistan as well, and also Russian speaking. So it just seems like it builds that trust with the community members you’re working with.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah. No. Absolutely. And I forgot to mention, but one of the languages I know, also Ukrainian. I actually lived in Crimea, went to school there and learned the language in school. And with everything that happened with Ukraine and the community coming here, it was so instrumental to be able to speak it and help as a community, to, you know, just adapt because they came running away from the wars that and Russian invasions that started. So a lot of them had very little or no English, so it was very important for them to be able to find someone who could help them who spoke the language.
Bryan Wright:
Mhmm. That’s so meaningful. And just, I mean, we’ve talked about this before, but just how, like, it’s always interesting how we all end up in Cincinnati. Right? I never thought I would end up in Cincinnati.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yes.
Bryan Wright:
And then here we are. And so yeah. And then either by force or by choice and just either way, but to find someone that can share a lived experience, share a language, that’s really powerful and meaningful. Yeah.
Clara Matonhodze:
So yeah. So how did you end up in Cincinnati, Nazly? So when did the conversation about potentially moving to The US? I’m assuming you moved to The US, or did you hit some stops along that way elsewhere?
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah. I blame my mother.
Clara Matonhodze:
You blame your mom? That’s how I ended up in Cincinnati.
Nazly Mamedova:
And, there’s a thing about Cincinnati. Right? Like Bryan was saying, you come here, you get stuck here.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yes. Uh-huh.
Nazly Mamedova:
Now choice, you know?
Bryan Wright:
Chores you in.
Nazly Mamedova:
Hey. I love Cincinnati. Now Cincinnati is home. I’ve lived here more than anywhere else in the world. So I’ve been here for over twenty years, and I came here because of my mom. Mhmm. And I end up going to Xavier. I’ve studied, ESL program for the first year, and then, Zadar gave me a grant to study for my bachelor’s.
Nazly Mamedova:
So I stayed and did that.
Bryan Wright:
What’s your major?
Nazly Mamedova:
International affairs.
Bryan Wright:
Okay.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. Okay.
Nazly Mamedova:
Okay. At some point, I knew I wanted to become a lawyer because my mom used to volunteer with me to interpret in the community. She’s like, oh, my daughter’s next to me. You know? She’ll translate. And she would be like, go help. And I’m like, okay. So at some point, I knew I’m gonna be an attorney. But then also mom’s side of the family, all been doctors except her.
Nazly Mamedova:
And my grandparents were like, please be a doctor. And I was like, I can be a Juris doctor. So Clever. Clever. Clever. Yeah. Went to law school and, you know, going back to languages, I feel like that’s one of the things that differentiates me from many other immigration attorneys is that, like, ability to connect with my clients, their culture and ability to understand the nuances that are sometimes so important, especially when you present clients in immigration court.
Clara Matonhodze:
That is so true.
Nazly Mamedova:
And yeah. A lot of times you see clearly that your judge and your prosecutor or DHS attorney do not understand and do not connect what your client is trying to testify about. And so really is cultural and language barrier
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
And not that your client is trying to lie to the court.
Clara Matonhodze:
Right. Yes.
Nazly Mamedova:
So being able to understand that and see that or even sometimes to hear that interpreter might be misinterpreting because no one else would know unless you spoke the language.
Clara Matonhodze:
Mhmm.
Nazly Mamedova:
And those kinds of things are very important and sometimes have a huge effect on your client’s case and the outcomes. Mhmm.
Bryan Wright:
But I think that’s I mean, you touched on there’s I mean, there’s so much there, but the fact that you saw that, your lived experience in growing up and the multiple languages, the multiple places that you lived, the multiple homes, not everyone would see that. It’s your experience, your training that allowed you to be able to see that. And I am just that’s really important and crucial. Right?
Clara Matonhodze:
And yeah.
Bryan Wright:
And it has an impact, not just from an empathic community building relationship piece, but it could shift the direction of their case in a meaningful way. Right? That’s Mhmm.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. Yeah. I wonder that spirit, Natalie, whether there was anything that was deeply personal that influenced your decision to say this is the type of law I want to practice? Because immigration law is really heartbreaking. You know? I mean, I always think of it as very bipolar. Right. So you have highs when someone’s case is successful. You know? It’s like the happiest day of their lives. Like, now you can be in America, or it could be the most heartbreaking when the denial comes. You know? So, is there a story behind you deciding to say, okay.
Clara Matonhodze:
I will do immigration law, or how what influenced your decision?
Nazly Mamedova:
Yes. So as I said earlier, my mom was kind of volunteering me in the community. And what I saw in our, like, state court systems is how a lot of times inability to speak English for people
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
Actually ended up messing up their due process rights. Right? And they weren’t getting things that they might have gotten, like, even, like, deals. Right. Or some other things, conditions dismissed as if they would have spoken English, as if they knew about their rights and maybe, like, hiring an attorney. You know? So I saw all this happening. Also, there’s an interesting theory, and I’m kind of like, oh, it makes sense to me now that people have a genetic code, and there’s something in them that comes generationally. And we have, like, in our family, my grandfather and his brothers who, like, fought for human rights when Stalin deported Crimean Tatars. You know, my grandfather’s brother was actually imprisoned, and he was protesting and, like, was starving and trying to make sure that Crimean Tatars go back to Crimea.
Clara Matonhodze:
Mhmm.
Nazly Mamedova:
So, we have, like, a lot of history in the family where the family was very politically active and participating and very much struggling but fighting for human rights. And I think that’s kinda, like, instilling into you. As a person. And I’m always, like, trying to protect people’s human rights.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. So maybe not the genetic coding, but it’s the stories that are being passed down through the generations that you grow up listening to. You know? And then when you’re older I know there are a lot of stories in my family about things that now only start to make sense. Right? And it’s like, my family has been right all along. So maybe that’s the same thing with you. It’s the stories that you grew up hearing about what happened to your family and what’s happening, and then that ultimately influences, you know, who you are.
Nazly Mamedova:
Absolutely. And I think, like, we maybe don’t understand that as children.
Clara Matonhodze:
No. We don’t.
Nazly Mamedova:
But then at this stage you’re starting to analyze this. And as you gain more knowledge, you look at things differently. Yeah. Sometimes I go back and I think about books I read as a child. Uh-huh. And now I’m like, oh my god. I need to reread it. Yeah.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Totally different.
Clara Matonhodze:
Uh-huh.
Nazly Mamedova:
So I was a kid growing up in the Post Soviet Union. Right?
Clara Matonhodze:
Uh-huh.
Nazly Mamedova:
I read Uncle Tom’s Cabin. Uh-huh. And it was, you know, a story. But then I came here, and learned more about the history of The United States.
Clara Matonhodze:
Uh-huh.
Nazly Mamedova:
And we looked at this book being very different.
Clara Matonhodze:
Very different. Right.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yes. Yeah. I totally get that, especially these days. I have started reading a lot of the books that I read when I was a child. I think for comfort, but you start realizing like, oh my gosh. This book has a totally different meaning. And, now I will admit okay. So I’m I’m I’m going to be I’m going to admit to this because, apparently, romance is back now, right, with, like, middle aged women.
Clara Matonhodze:
They’re reading a lot of romance novels. So there’s this series called the Calder series from Janet Dailey. She’s kinda like Danielle Steel. Lots of romance novels. And I remember when I was in high school, I read all the series, and I just thought they were the greatest love stories. I was in love with Montana. I wanted to go and live in Montana, and, yeah, I’m in Zimbabwe. And because that was the setting.
Clara Matonhodze:
You know? And so I started rereading that series, and I just cannot identify with it. I’m like, what was I? Yeah. It just seems very, otherworldly. Like, I don’t know what I identified in these novels at that young age, but yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah.
Clara Matonhodze:
So I get the rereading of books and a totally different perspective once you start reading them again.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah. Absolutely. We recently had a conversation in our office. We were like, oh my god. Abe’s great. And we were reading Dostoevsky. And, like, and teachers were expecting us to analyze that, all that, or war and peace, which is like and I’m like, how? And now, like, going back, rereading it, it’s so different. I agree.
Clara Matonhodze:
Absolutely. Yeah.
Bryan Wright:
Yeah. So I didn’t feel like I need to go back and read Crime and Punishment and as an adult, it was
Nazly Mamedova:
So yeah.
Clara Matonhodze:
Well, a couple years ago, I reread Anna Karenina. You know? And it wasn’t as daunting. And I’m like, why was this book supposed to be a very difficult book? At least, at the time that I first read it, it was supposed to be an extremely difficult book, and I remember thinking that. But now I’m like, It’s just a romantic love story, it feels like. But yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah. I was so sorry.
Bryan Wright:
It’s like as we get older, things get simpler, but I also feel like it gets more complicated. It’s a little bit of both.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. Yeah. It’s a range. It’s a range.
Bryan Wright:
So when you finished well, one thing you meant it’s essentially, you mentioned uncle Tom’s cabin as a book written by Harriet Beecher Stowe, who also has a house in Cincinnati. And it’s just making that Cincinnati connection interesting. Yeah. I mean, it’s nothing deeper than that, but it’s just funny how that connection happens.
Nazly Mamedova:
But I also live in the West End. So, like, that whole area, you know, the underground railroads, like, oh my god. There’s so much connection. And it’s so interesting Cincinnati, like, I think about this all the time. We actually have so much history here and so many connections. And there’s so many Hollywood movies where Cincinnati pops up. That’s like Randomly. Oh, we know Cincinnati. I’m like, how? They’re like, yeah, we’ve heard about it. I’m like all over the world, you know? So we’re small but mighty.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah.
Bryan Wright:
I love it. We talked about earlier that none of us are from here, and then, you know, like, we love it and sing its praises and such. And, you know, increasingly, there’s more and more films coming out that were filmed in Cincinnati.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. Yeah.
Bryan Wright:
We might have the Sundance Film Festival here, and it’s really growing. I moved here in 2008. And so just even from that time and how it’s evolved, it’s been just wonderful to see the changes and growth of it. So
Clara Matonhodze:
It’s it’s it’s a very it’s a very different city now. I came here early two thousand years ago. And when I first came to Cincinnati, I always intended like my port of entry was Philadelphia. But I came here for school and because Philadelphia is very expensive, and the intention was I’m just gonna come. I’m just gonna go to Cincinnati, go to NKU because it’s extremely cheap, and then go back. Alright? And I’ve never left Cincinnati.
Nazly Mamedova:
Have you guys seen a mural right next to the casino when you drive into the city, and it says something about, like, leaving no matter where we are in the world, but our hearts remain in Cincinnati? And I feel like this is so see that?
Clara Matonhodze:
Where is that mural? I haven’t seen it.
Nazly Mamedova:
It’s right across from the casino. So and but it’s, like, so big Christianity of Cincinnati.
Clara Matonhodze:
Nice.
Bryan Wright:
Not beautiful. Beautiful. So when you came to Xavier, went to law school, did you when you completed law school, did you jump into your own firm? Did you work in another practice? And yeah. Tell us about that journey.
Nazly Mamedova:
So while I was in law school, I was doing a lot of internships, like, starting my first year. You know, I interned with Kentucky Ministries, and then I interned with, Alex’s office who was at that time, Lubens Otto, who was at that time a private practitioner, but then became director, right, as a not director, but, like, lead attorney at the immigrant refugee law center. So and then I interned with Judge Black, who, like, I’m seriously so thankful to these days that he gave me that opportunity because to get a judicial internship was very hard. And, him, like, taking on me was amazing opportunities that he gave me that some other people might have not. And interned at some other local law firms including OJPC. So we were talking about that earlier. Yeah. So, Tyra, like, I worked on her case actually, and I was joking earlier, but not really joking.
Nazly Mamedova:
Like, I remember driving with another class, not classmates, with another intern, right, to data and to try to get the documents signed, you know, for her case when we were working on her release. And then with all that, I had already had enough experience where I was able to actually join another private practitioner as a counsel. So I work with Charleston Wong. And, for, I wanna say, about three, three or four years. And, after that, I went completely on my own.
Bryan Wright:
So what that going on your own, that is I mean, I think of, like, the entrepreneurial mind. Right? And so that’s quite a leap, right, to want to go out on your own, own your own practice. Was that always the plan, or was there yeah. What was that process like to go from working with someone else to then taking a leap and starting your own practice?
Nazly Mamedova:
So I wouldn’t say it was always a plan, but it’s become a plan as a necessity to improve the services for my clients. So, I just wanted to and hopefully I still am. But, I just want to be like more out there and use and utilize the newer things that we have available to us as tools in immigration law. Immigration law changes on a daily basis, so there’s so much happening. And now with, like, use of AI as we were talking earlier. Right? There’s, so many new tools and other things that we can do. And it’s interesting, but a lot of law firms, just in general, like the legal field, are very conservative and kind of hold back. And I’m trying to be more progressive out there.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah. And just besides, like, using tools, for example, my law firm this year, we switched to four work days for our employees.
Clara Matonhodze:
Oh, nice.
Nazly Mamedova:
Instead of five days. So they still get paid for five. Right? But we work four days because I want them to have, like, an extra day off because there is a research that, you know, if they have this, like, extra weekday off where they can go to their doctor’s appointments and other things, your employees actually become more productive.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. Yeah. They’re more productive, healthier and happier. Yeah. Yeah. Right.
Nazly Mamedova:
And there was so much research on that that I was like, hey, someone really smart went and looked at it.
Clara Matonhodze:
Uh-huh.
Nazly Mamedova:
So let me try this. You know?
Clara Matonhodze:
How’s that working out?
Nazly Mamedova:
My employees are very happy. So I love my employees. So I want everyone to be happy.
Bryan Wright:
You mean, trusting research and data and science? That’s amazing.
Clara Matonhodze:
Well, thank goodness it does.
Bryan Wright:
You know, you talked about wanting to be, you know, helpful for your clients and such. And, obviously, I mean, you’ve given a few examples because of your, you know, your experience, the languages you speak and relating, you’re getting recognition. I mean, we are talking to a recipient of the best attorney of the year. Yeah. From and so does that recognition or receiving the award and, you know, does that help, you know, if like Clara mentioned, it’s really immigration laws or practice can be very sad, but it also can be very rewarding. I mean, I imagine there are stories there too. So I have a follow-up question for that. But with this recognition, I mean, does that help motivate you? Is that something just it’s nice, but you’re focused on other things.
Bryan Wright:
Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah. It’s nice, but I think the bigger recognition comes from my clients. So, I think this is a very fitting example. Yesterday, the whole morning, I spent in a Boone County jail actually, very sad. Like, one of the clients got arrested. We went to visit her. She was crying. We were crying.
Nazly Mamedova:
We came back and called her husband, and told him a kind of summary of what we went through. My clerk was crying, telling that to the husband. My husband was crying on the phone, you know, a very devastating moment. And then in the afternoon, another person came with our client who I have known since she was a child and she got her green card. So that’s like a celebrity thing, right? We took a picture, and she brought us cookies. She thanked us so many times because at the time when we started her process, her father actually didn’t believe in the process and didn’t really want to go with it. And me and my other clerk, we pushed for it. We said, no.
Nazly Mamedova:
No. No. You need to do this. This is very important for the future of your daughter. You know? And then she comes back and says, thank you so much. Thank you so much for, like, doing this for me because if you didn’t push at that time, we would have never done it. Mhmm. My dad would have been just whatever.
Nazly Mamedova:
And because he didn’t want to help a child. Right? But mistrust, also little knowledge. And she was like, I’m so thankful. And I was like, you know what? I always believed in you, like, that this would happen. And, it’s amazing. Like, now she’s a legal permanent resident. She is a very, very, likable, great person and also a contributing member to our community. She works and she now has her own child.
Nazly Mamedova:
So it’s like yeah. And there are so many stories like this.
Clara Matonhodze:
High and low.
Bryan Wright:
Yes.
Clara Matonhodze:
In one day. Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah. And there’s so many stories like that. And some people, like, we’ve serviced, like, families and several generations, you know, applying for green cards, citizenships, like marriages, fiance visas, and things like that. And you see those like families grow and you know that you are contributing to this family’s well-being. This is probably the biggest recognition that, like, is also very motivating to us.
Bryan Wright:
Right. I’m so glad you shared it because it’s so important to remember that, yes, it is you can just get so weighted down with, I mean, the communities are being attacked, you know, and it’s, or feeling the daily stresses of it. But through your work, yes, there is that kind of you know, you’re an attorney. You provide that technical assistance to the navigation of immigration law, but you also bring hope to people and joy. You know? You hope that there is some kind of relief or pathway or and then but also bringing joy when someone comes to you that you’ve seen grow up and say, here’s my green card. Thank you for this. And that’s so it’s yeah. That’s a wonderful place to be in and reminding that at times.
Bryan Wright:
So that’s thank you for sharing that.
Nazly Mamedova:
Absolutely. And I always say I am so lucky because I actually have a job that I love and enjoy, and I know that a lot of people can’t say that about their jobs.
Clara Matonhodze:
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
But, I am so lucky that this is a very, like, fulfilling area of law where you get to actually help people and see the impact of your actions. So beside being an attorney, Bryan, also 90% of the time, I’m also, like, a psychologist in the therapist and, like, all kinds of support for, like, those families.
Bryan Wright:
Right.
Clara Matonhodze:
Well, that’s an incredible story, Nazly. And, can’t imagine, can’t imagine your days, you know, the highs and lows. But, anyway, we’ll leave it at that, and we will continue our conversation with Nazly after we take a break.
Bryan Wright:
Beautiful. Thank you.
Bryan Wright:
Welcome back to roots, routes, and voices that shape America. If you’re just joining us, we’ll continue our conversation with Nazly Mamedova and her experience immigrating to America and establishing roots in Cincinnati.
Clara Matonhodze:
This has been such a wonderful conversation so far, Nazly. And, you know, having gone through some of the immigration system myself, you know, I’m really having a lot of moments here. So, let’s continue with some of your experience. What has been one of the most significant barriers that your clients face when they are integrating into American society?
Nazly Mamedova:
Oh, it’s so different for every group. Right? Yeah. America is a country of immigrants. And when we talk about immigrants, we talk about so many different groups of immigrants. We’re talking about different socioeconomic levels, different levels of education or maybe skills, right? And trades that they’ve learned. So I feel like every group has their own barriers that they face. But in general, from what I hear from people a lot and what makes us so great is that people find America welcoming. And this is so interesting because you sometimes show up in immigration court and knowing the issues our country has you see these people saying immigration judge let me stay in America because this is the best place and safest place for me.
Nazly Mamedova:
And that makes you think of Oh my God, where did they come from? What experiences they’ve had. Right?
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
And as I said, it’s amazing, but America is welcoming.
Clara Matonhodze:
It is very welcoming.
Nazly Mamedova:
Yes. And yeah. I think we need to make sure we do not lose this ability of Yeah. Continually welcoming the immigrants.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. Yeah. America is extremely welcoming. You know, I am just talking about that. I have this vivid memory when I first came to The US of, you know, NPR when they do the drives where you send money, like, I remember going, are they crazy? Like, who do they think is going to give money? And do you know? But then not realizing how generous at the time that Americans are. And here, this radio station year after year is actually how it fundraised, but at the time, I just thought it was such a foreign idea to me. Like, you just randomly sent money to some place that you don’t know, and this is how this business exists. And I think nothing encompasses the welcoming and trustfulness or trustworthiness or, you know, that NPR. It just sums up everything that’s great and good about Amer about the American spirit.
Clara Matonhodze:
You know?
Nazly Mamedova:
Absolutely. And I’m gonna actually talk about this. This is so funny. I volunteered several for several years with a local organization here at Cincinnati, Give Back Cincinnati. And we had the Give Back Beyond Cincinnati where we went on trips outside of the country, right, to other countries and did the bills. So you have to pay for your trip. You have to pay for the materials. You have to pay for your flight and then some administrative fees to go then and volunteer and work in another country to build houses, you know, to put the center blocks together, to like, learn how to use a chainsaw and some other things.
Nazly Mamedova:
So people in those communities, in those countries were like, those crazy Americans, like, way pain, way pain, way pain, way pain, way pain. Yeah. This is such an American thing and such an American value of giving and giving back. Yeah. So I’m also on the board of the Red Cross here locally and this whole idea of giving is a very much American, American trade that we carry.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
So yes. I totally emphasize with you that some people were like crazy people. Right? Why would you spend money on it to come, like, do things?
Clara Matonhodze:
Do menial labor at that too. Right? Yeah. Yeah. But what barriers do you think immigrants face? Like, I know you did say that, it all depends on different communities. But is there a single barrier that kind of runs across the different communities in terms of integration?
Nazly Mamedova:
Yes. Most of the time, it is a language. Language. Okay. Ability to speak English and not just speak it because a lot of the time we see people learn quickly to speak it, but then also understand it completely. Right? There’s still barriers with that and I feel like a lot of people face it, all the time. We now have interns who are LLM students, from UC and who are attorneys in their countries and they have, like, excellent English and it’s still the barriers that they face now in preparation, for example, for the bar exam. Right? So even like the highest educated levels of immigrants that we see, right, still language is the number one barrier.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah. It’s definitely a language.
Bryan Wright:
Sorry. What do you think? What just for their listeners, LLM, what does that mean?
Nazly Mamedova:
It’s a law, a master’s in law.
Clara Matonhodze:
Okay.
Nazly Mamedova:
Master’s in legal studies, they say.
Clara Matonhodze:
Oh my god. For some reason, I was thinking of a large language model. Different industries. Overlapping. A totally different industry. But, yes, language is a barrier. I have often been told by friends that I know who are in really high positions about the experience even in corporate America where they go. When everybody starts talking about references to movies, I don’t get it. You know? Like, I don’t get the sarcasm.
Clara Matonhodze:
I don’t get the reference to what movies are saying about our business, and this is at a really high level. So language does go through, I think, across the range of difficulties in integration. So when in that zone about challenges and misconceptions, what is the biggest misconception in your opinion you think Americans have about immigrants?
Nazly Mamedova:
So oh my god. So many misconceptions, but I will start with, like, the common one. Oh, immigrants are coming to this country to take our jobs. They’re coming here illegally. Right?
Clara Matonhodze:
Oh, yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
He hears this all the time. Yeah. And I feel like people say this without going anywhere deeper into looking at, like, why they’re saying this, where it’s coming from, you know. And what do you mean by saying we use the word undocumented. But a lot of times they use illegal terms. Right? Right.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
So it’s like, who do you mean? Because anyone who was here legally undocumented in a bat of an eye can become undocumented. Mhmm. So it’s so easy to lose your status.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yes.
Nazly Mamedova:
For example, there has been a push from the current administration. Well, they already stopped the temporary protected status for several countries. Right? Haiti, Venezuela, and now push for Ukrainians too. So these are people who entered The United States legally, documented, right? Have work permits, social securities, contributing members of our community. And then with one executive order, they’re gonna become, the word they use right? Illegal.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
So a lot of times, I think the biggest misconception is that people don’t know how complicated immigration system is.
Clara Matonhodze:
Mhmm.
Nazly Mamedova:
And I just taught actually a three hour class at OLLI at UC and all three hours were spent on basically explaining the myth about immigration. So, and answering the questions of people they had. Had. They were like, oh, if you’re married to Americans, that’s it. You get a green card, you get citizenship. All these things. And I’m like, nope. That is not how it works.
Clara Matonhodze:
It’s not that easy.
Nazly Mamedova:
So complicated. And there’s so many other things that are in the play. And it’s just people who’ve never actually dealt with it and never looked at it, they think it’s very easy. And this is like the biggest misconception that we have. It’s so interesting. So going back to Ukrainians now, I have a really good friend of mine who’s Ukrainian and who’s on you for you here. And now with everything happening, a lot of moms in schools of her child are like, what can we do? How can we support you? How can we make sure you guys stay here? Right? We don’t want our children to lose their classmates, you know, and your family. So a lot of them are trying to advocate.
Nazly Mamedova:
But they like it, we’re trying to help them and educate them because a lot of them don’t know anything about immigration or how it works. And normally, the first thing I send people is to talk to your representatives. It’s important. So tell them about things that are important to you. And they do represent you, so they have to listen to you.
Bryan Wright:
Yeah. You know, I mean, you kind of anticipated what I was gonna ask you around what communities can do to work together to better understand and support the systems. And you’ve kind of touched on it already. One, it’s just starting with education because there are a lot of strong opinions about immigration as a practice and and as a system as a system of laws. And I think people don’t necessarily understand them. Or you hear misconceptions of, oh, just get in line. Well, which line?
Bryan Wright:
There are not really lines. And if there are, they’re very long. And there’s you know? So you’ve touched on this around education, but what are some other things that communities can do to work together to help build better understanding and support systems of newcomers and immigrants?
Nazly Mamedova:
Yeah. So, right now, specifically, with everything that’s happening in immigration field, I think supporting each other, protecting each other is very important for the communities because there has been so much enforcement and detention happening since the new administration came to power and people are just scared. They live in fear. People are scared to send their children to schools. People are scared to show up to work and seek any help from the police, right? Or seek medical help. Everyone lives in fear. So being there for your neighbors, co workers who are immigrants, right? And supporting them. Giving a right to someone can make a huge difference in their lives nowadays.
Nazly Mamedova:
So, I think the biggest thing we can do is have both the business community, you know, non profits and then individuals come together and say our immigrant communities are important for us. They drive our economy, you know. They are integrated into our societies and we are going to protect them. Because what the federal government is pushing right now is a lot of times very much, compared to what the Nazis did with Jews. Right? The registration system that USCIS is pushing. The system where you can call and report, like they say illegal aliens, you know. Like all this is starting to remind us of the divide that is being created between them and us. And creating a fear of them.
Nazly Mamedova:
So, I think Lexus is also part of our history, right? In The US, we always had throughout the years depending on which area you look at that boogeyman, right? At some point it was Chinese, right? And we had a Chinese exclusion act. Then it was Japanese and we had those entrapping camps. And then it was you know Mexicans at some point. And then it was Muslims, right? The Muslim ban, nineeleven.
Nazly Mamedova:
So now it’s immigrants. And creating the situation where we control people with fear of that other is what our government is doing. And I think this is the biggest thing we need to fight, and we need to be united in fighting it.
Bryan Wright:
Right. No. I think you’re right. And, you know, you mentioned earlier about how there are still large communities that are quite welcoming and leaning on them. So I think it’s with troubled waters, there are communities that are coming together to help support. So I think in just one because we are getting close to time. I have one question that, you know, if you were writing your own immigrant story, what would the title be and why?
Nazly Mamedova:
Okay. This is so cheesy, and everyone uses it.
Nazly Mamedova:
Right? But, like, I feel like everyone who comes to America, right, is, like, leaving or trying to live the American dream. And I have such a base in American people because for every bad thing that I see in the news nowadays, I see 20 other groups that are ready to fight it. Like, that is there to stand up and to protect others’ rights. So it makes America really great, you know. And no matter what the others say
Clara Matonhodze:
Well said like the immigrant and as we forever, with the right spirit. Right? And appreciation for what America is.
Nazly Mamedova:
Absolutely. Because as I said, no. We have our own issues. As an attorney, I’m very well aware of our own issues.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yeah.
Nazly Mamedova:
Being an immigrant myself, I’m very aware of our issues. But at the end of the day, you know, a lot of people find this country to be the best.
Clara Matonhodze:
Yes.
Nazly Mamedova:
And we need to make sure we remain the best. And welcoming others is the way we remain the best. So I don’t know what I would name it, but something about probably living the American dream, you know, and being able to stand up for others when they can’t. So something along those lines.
Clara Matonhodze:
I love that, Nazly. I think you are indeed living your American dream and helping others around us. And on that note, we want to say thank you so much for joining us today.
Bryan Wright:
Thank you so much.
Nazly Mamedova:
Thank you.
Bryan Wright:
Thank you. To everyone at home, we appreciate you for joining us today. If you haven’t already, you can subscribe to Roots, Routes, and Voices That Shape America wherever you stream your podcast. Visit https://cincinnaticompass.org/ to sign up for our newsletter and stay connected about upcoming community events.
Clara Matonhodze:
Our producers are Asiya Mishu and Jane Muindi. Sound engineering and mixing provided by Heartcast Media. Unsigned engineers are Peter and Audrey, and eleven twenty seven Media. A very special thank you to the Forest Park branch library of the Cincinnati Hamilton County Public Library for hosting and our sponsor, the Carol Ann and Ralph V. Hale Foundation. I’m your cohost, Clara Matonhodze, and thanks for listening.